Question: How to drill the engine mount to the firewall
- RVNewsletter
- Class D
- Posts: 259
- Joined: Wed Mar 29, 2006 9:57 am
- Location: St. Paul, MN.
- Contact:
Question: How to drill the engine mount to the firewall
I'm missing something somewhere because it's not entirely clear the best wa to attach the engine mount to the firewall on my 7A project and I'm looking for advice (or preferably pictures) from others.
The problem I'm having is do you CLAMP it in place so it doesn't move while you're drilling. I made the mistake of drilling small pilot holes in the prepunched fuselage but only one is really off a little bit and I don't think that'll be a problem.
But it looks to me like you'd have to use the engine mount as a drill guide, right? And that would require a "T" or "U" jobber bit because otherwise, you have no chance of getting the hole centered properly.
But a T or U is a pretty big piece of cheese to be drilling through firewall, angle, and steel with and, besides, without good clamping, you run the risk of having the thing shift a little bit and then you're really screwed.
I've looked all around and can't find a good way to clamp this thing other than a 2x4 across the front and a long pipe clamp through the recess and clamping to the rudder pedals but that still doesn't give you a firm clamp to prevent it from shifting.
I suppose one option is to drill one corner out to fullsize without using the engine mount as a drill guide, and then inserting a bolt and tightening it down, but will that be enough to keep it from shifting around as you go to drill the other holes -- and now you WOULD have to use the mount as a drill guide and now I'm back to the apparent problem of using a large drill for an initial hole which seems wrong.
Any advice appreciated.
The problem I'm having is do you CLAMP it in place so it doesn't move while you're drilling. I made the mistake of drilling small pilot holes in the prepunched fuselage but only one is really off a little bit and I don't think that'll be a problem.
But it looks to me like you'd have to use the engine mount as a drill guide, right? And that would require a "T" or "U" jobber bit because otherwise, you have no chance of getting the hole centered properly.
But a T or U is a pretty big piece of cheese to be drilling through firewall, angle, and steel with and, besides, without good clamping, you run the risk of having the thing shift a little bit and then you're really screwed.
I've looked all around and can't find a good way to clamp this thing other than a 2x4 across the front and a long pipe clamp through the recess and clamping to the rudder pedals but that still doesn't give you a firm clamp to prevent it from shifting.
I suppose one option is to drill one corner out to fullsize without using the engine mount as a drill guide, and then inserting a bolt and tightening it down, but will that be enough to keep it from shifting around as you go to drill the other holes -- and now you WOULD have to use the mount as a drill guide and now I'm back to the apparent problem of using a large drill for an initial hole which seems wrong.
Any advice appreciated.
I used sleeves that fit the engine mount with 1/4†bolts through them and the firewall and bolted the corners down then drilled the firewall using the mount as a guide. The combination of stainless steel and aluminum is a pia to drill. Go slow and be patient and use oil. I broke two drill bits doing it and almost broke my wrist but they turned out sweet.
- Wicked Stick
- Class B
- Posts: 1000
- Joined: Wed Feb 09, 2005 10:00 pm
- Location: KEWB
Here's how I did mine. It also appears to be the most common method. All I can say is it came out perfect.
http://www.flightinnovations.com/fwf.ht ... nt_Install
http://www.flightinnovations.com/fwf.ht ... nt_Install
Bret Smith
9A Flying (N16BL)
Blue Ridge, GA
http://www.FlightInnovations.com
APRS Tracking: http://www.flightinnovations.com/tracking.html
9A Flying (N16BL)
Blue Ridge, GA
http://www.FlightInnovations.com
APRS Tracking: http://www.flightinnovations.com/tracking.html
- RVNewsletter
- Class D
- Posts: 259
- Joined: Wed Mar 29, 2006 9:57 am
- Location: St. Paul, MN.
- Contact:
I got an email from a Minn. Winger (of VAF) who used bushings inside of bushings inside of bushing, to use the mount as a drill guide with a 1/8" pilot hole, stepping up...so as not to break a wrist etc. That seemed like a good idea, especially since I already have undersized holes here that might be veryyyy slightly off center..
what I don't quite understand is how to keep the mount stable while using it as a drill guide. Are you guys clamping it? Or are you drilling out one hole and snugging it down and then another etc.? It looks like the dangers of slipping are high here, which, of course, immediately affects the other hole locations.
Bret, if I followed you correctly, the first hole was simply drilled, not match drilled?
what I don't quite understand is how to keep the mount stable while using it as a drill guide. Are you guys clamping it? Or are you drilling out one hole and snugging it down and then another etc.? It looks like the dangers of slipping are high here, which, of course, immediately affects the other hole locations.
Bret, if I followed you correctly, the first hole was simply drilled, not match drilled?
Bob,
A popular method is to use the builders third hand, otherwise known as duct tape. Here is a picture from a random web site to illustrate:
[/i]
I am about a week or two from doing it, and it seems like the legit way to go. What I also plan to do is use some trimmed 2x4's to support the bottom (use them between the floor and the bottom of the mount). I figure I can get them perfectly aligned by shimming up with random scraps of sheet. I don't totally trust duct tape to keep everything perfectly aligned, but it will help hold the mount snug to the firewall.
Good luck! I also heard with the two bottom middle mounts there is a chance you might need a spacer between the firewall and the mount.
A popular method is to use the builders third hand, otherwise known as duct tape. Here is a picture from a random web site to illustrate:
[/i]
I am about a week or two from doing it, and it seems like the legit way to go. What I also plan to do is use some trimmed 2x4's to support the bottom (use them between the floor and the bottom of the mount). I figure I can get them perfectly aligned by shimming up with random scraps of sheet. I don't totally trust duct tape to keep everything perfectly aligned, but it will help hold the mount snug to the firewall.
Good luck! I also heard with the two bottom middle mounts there is a chance you might need a spacer between the firewall and the mount.
Mike Bullock
http://www.rvplane.com
RV-7 | Superior IO-360 | Whirlwind 200RV
Garmin GTN650 | GRT Dual Sport SX EFIS
Status: FLYING!
http://www.rvplane.com
RV-7 | Superior IO-360 | Whirlwind 200RV
Garmin GTN650 | GRT Dual Sport SX EFIS
Status: FLYING!
i took 3/8 bolts , cut the heads off, turned them down to 1/4 and threaded them to 28 tpi on the 1/4" end. drilled the first hole to 1/4" inserted the bolt to the firewall and hung the mount then i carefully drilled the remaining holes with a bushing and a 1/4 " bit. inserting more "special" bolts as i went. once i had four 1/4 inch holes in the firewall i finsh drilled them to 3/8...it not uncommon for the two bolts at the lower bottom the need to be shimmed @ approx .063.. i made washers with the flycutter.
i must admit they did come out perfect ..at least something on this plane is.
i must admit they did come out perfect ..at least something on this plane is.
william....don't let it beat you down, you are stronger than you think.
-
- Class C
- Posts: 625
- Joined: Sat Nov 13, 2004 8:37 pm
- Location: Sartell MN
Spacers is the simplist method of drilling small pilot holes and then using some cheap hardware store bolts again using spacers to temporarly fasten the engine mount to the firewall. Then you go around and enlarge each hole to the full size and have the mount secured in the other holes. I already e-mailed Bob directly but I wanted to make sure my password is finally really working.
this is true and is probally the best method for most builders... however, having plenty of time and a lathe at work it was far easier to do it the way i did than to shop for sleeves with specific diamters inside and out..and various different size bolts. there was zero setup error. just a trip to lowes or the ,metal supply shop usually costs me 100$ total out of pocket was .00$ and 20 minutes..which is how long it takes me to get to lowes. nevermind the time spent there and the trip by arby's or krispy kreme then back home..shoot man, thats almost a whole saturday. i was saving time and time alone. this time it just happened to work really well.Bob Barrett wrote:Spacers is the simplist method of drilling small pilot holes and then using some cheap hardware store bolts again using spacers to temporarly fasten the engine mount to the firewall. Then you go around and enlarge each hole to the full size and have the mount secured in the other holes. I already e-mailed Bob directly but I wanted to make sure my password is finally really working.
william....don't let it beat you down, you are stronger than you think.
I wasn't planning on drilling my engine mount today, but I finished the canopy frame (for now), and had more time than I thought I would have, so I went for it!
I did the same thing Bret did...drilled the top left WITHOUT THE MOUNT ON THE FW, held the mount up, installed the bolt and tightened it, then I used the mount as a drill guide using a 3/8" drill for the remaining holes. It's slow going thru the steel pieces, but it works fine. I did use a stand that I had around with some wood spacers to help hold the mount from the bottom.
Once you have that first bolt in, it's really no big deal to drill the remaining holes.
I checked the mount against the fuselage when I was done, and the bubbles are indentical. Just follow Van's instructions, and it works!
Have you drilled yours yet Bob?
I did the same thing Bret did...drilled the top left WITHOUT THE MOUNT ON THE FW, held the mount up, installed the bolt and tightened it, then I used the mount as a drill guide using a 3/8" drill for the remaining holes. It's slow going thru the steel pieces, but it works fine. I did use a stand that I had around with some wood spacers to help hold the mount from the bottom.
Once you have that first bolt in, it's really no big deal to drill the remaining holes.
I checked the mount against the fuselage when I was done, and the bubbles are indentical. Just follow Van's instructions, and it works!
Have you drilled yours yet Bob?
- Wicked Stick
- Class B
- Posts: 1000
- Joined: Wed Feb 09, 2005 10:00 pm
- Location: KEWB