Finish color over AKZO

Cherokee Driver · Post by **Cherokee Driver** » Sat Oct 24, 2009 12:45 pm

I was speaking with my EAA tech counselor a month ago or so and I recall him saying that AKZO is a primer that it is hard to find other paints to stick to. I didn't think much of it at the time since I never planned to paint over the primer since it would not show. Now that I am finishing up elevators, I see that the 713 is in fact going to need a surface color.

So have any of you painted your finish colors over AKZO? did it work OK?" What have you tried?

The 713 shown above primed with AKZO.

Thanks in advance for any information.

CD

Post by **bullojm1** » Sat Oct 24, 2009 1:04 pm

CD-

Your TC is right -- paint won't stick to AKZO. However, if you rough it up with some sandpaper and re-prime/paint you will be fine. I needed to do that somewhere on my build over AKZO and it wasn't an issue.

Cherokee Driver · Post by **Cherokee Driver** » Sat Oct 24, 2009 1:17 pm

Thanks Mike. You are always quick on the draw with answers.

Do you recall what primer you hit it with after you roughed up the AKZO?

CD

Post by **bullojm1** » Sat Oct 24, 2009 1:37 pm

I used NAPA 7220 self-etching primer, then topcoated with either white High performance Rustoleum or my interior color - JetFlex. However, I don't recall exactly what it was, but those are my only two topcoats, so it has to be one or the other!

cnpeters · Post by **cnpeters** » Sun Oct 25, 2009 4:01 pm

Mike - can you tell me a bit about the Jetflex? I am debating spraying something like that for my interior (also primed in places with Napa 7220) vs using rattle cans for ease of use. I sort of want to spray to learn it as I have never done it (have a Porter Cable PSH1 HVLP sprayer). Easy to use? Good adherence? Resistant/hard finish? Where to acquire (call a SW aerospace rep?)?
Thanks,
Carl

captain_john · Post by **captain_john** » Mon Oct 26, 2009 8:26 am

HUH!?!

What? (How did I miss this earlier?)

A topcoat doesn't like to stick to a primer? Sounds like a wife's tale to me!

A suitable substrate is a suitable substrate!

First of all, AKZO is a primer. Any primer that has fully cured needs to be sanded in order to provide an adhesion profile to begin with. That will also clean the surface prior to top coating.

I am willing to bet that any quality top coat will adhere without any issues, provided you prep the surface according to the instructions.

Don't worry about it at all.

CJ

Post by **bullojm1** » Mon Oct 26, 2009 8:37 am

cnpeters wrote:Mike - can you tell me a bit about the Jetflex? I am debating spraying something like that for my interior (also primed in places with Napa 7220) vs using rattle cans for ease of use. I sort of want to spray to learn it as I have never done it (have a Porter Cable PSH1 HVLP sprayer). Easy to use? Good adherence? Resistant/hard finish? Where to acquire (call a SW aerospace rep?)?
Thanks,
Carl

Carl,

I have been very happy with the results I have gotton with JetFlex. I am using the WR (water reducible) formula, which makes thinning and cleanup an absolute walk in the park. It is SUPER THICK, so spraying it is interesting. Not hard, but you need to proactive a little with the pressure/flow/fan settings on your gun.

As far as ruggedness, it seems to be VERY strong. I can use acetone to clean it up without taking off too much of the paint. Try using an acetone soaked rag on a panel that was spray painted!

The finish is the real beauty of JetFlex. Depending on your pressure setting, you can either achieve a smooth finish or a textured finish.

Here is where I bought mine. Call them up and they will send you a color chart:

Advanced Aircraft Coatings
1216 N. Council Rd.
Oklahoma City, OK 73127
(405) 495-7545
(405) 495-7548 Fax
E-mail: okaacinc@aol.com

TomNativeNewYorker · Post by **TomNativeNewYorker** » Mon Oct 26, 2009 10:02 am

captain_john wrote: Any primer that has fully cured needs to be sanded in order to provide an adhesion profile to begin with. That will also clean the surface prior to top coating.

light scuff sand and then a solvent wipe using something that does not leave a residue behind(such as M.E.K.).

cnpeters · Post by **cnpeters** » Mon Oct 26, 2009 10:22 am

Thanks, Mike. Not to hijack this thread, but could you also give me the settings and tip size you used to give me a start? I went ahead and called them and they are sending a color chart.

Post by **bullojm1** » Mon Oct 26, 2009 11:18 am

cnpeters wrote:Thanks, Mike. Not to hijack this thread, but could you also give me the settings and tip size you used to give me a start? I went ahead and called them and they are sending a color chart.

Carl,

I have a cheap Harbor Freight HVLP gun that doesn't have specific settings. I pretty much tune the gun by feel. I have my supply pressure at 50 psi, with maybe 5-10 psi at the tip. Next I adjust the flow outward, and then the fan setting. Next I adjust the flow to match the fan size, and adjust the pressure finally to control the texture. It sounds complicated, but once you figure out how all three settings work together in harmony, it takes no time to do it. ALSO, be sure to thin the JetFlex out with distilled water -- no more than 105 or you will get some orange peel.

One last bit of advice is find a spray can primer that is lighter in color than the JetFlex color you are choosing. I used a gray primer and getting it covered up with Tan paint was a chore.

captain_john · Post by **captain_john** » Mon Oct 26, 2009 1:51 pm

TomNativeNewYorker wrote:
captain_john wrote: Any primer that has fully cured needs to be sanded in order to provide an adhesion profile to begin with. That will also clean the surface prior to top coating.
light scuff sand and then a solvent wipe using something that does not leave a residue behind(such as M.E.K.).

YUP!

What he said!

CJ