Undecided between 7A and 9A

This is a forum to ask questions regarding the different models of Vans Aircraft. If you are having problems deciding which one to build, this is the place to go.
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Thomas
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Undecided between 7A and 9A

Post by Thomas »

Hello,

I'm still in the dreaming stages here, but anyone have any input on a 7A vs. a 9A? I like the look of the longer, thinner wing, and the economy of the 9A, but I like the aerobatic capabilities of the 7A and the greater bagage capacity.

Also, after looking a dozens of builder's sites, I've noticed that most people are building the tip-up canopy. Any reason? The sliding one a lot harder to build?

Thanks,

Tom

Spike
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Post by Spike »

For my money the tip up looks a lot cleaner on the side by side models (especially the A variants) and it gets rid of that pesky bar in the windscreen.

As far as 7A vs 9A, what do you want to do?

John
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Thomas
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Post by Thomas »

I have never done aerobatics, but would like the ability to have that option. Problem is, I'm get stuck on asthetics, and I think the wing on the 9A looks WAY better... and afterall, aren't most of us into flying (at least in part) cause we love the way these flying machines look???

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Post by Spike »

What kind of flying do you do now?

-- Spike
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Thomas
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Post by Thomas »

I owned a PA-28-150 for 3 years. Mostly boring holes in the sky and trips of 300 miles or less. I would like to be able to do more cross countries - the cherokee was so unreliable (avionics-wise) that I wasn't comfortable using it for that.

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smittysrv
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Post by smittysrv »

It depends on what kind of flying you want to do. I have a Cessna 172 and just love going on long cross countries. I like the long glide on approach and the overall stability with the Stol kit it has. It's a creampuff of an airplane to fly.

This is how the 9-A is. Easy to fly, easy stall, long glide on final and a creampuff to fly. It's not as fast as the 7-A, but I don't care. It's still 55-60 miles an hour faster than my Cessna. I also have no interest in aerobatics.

The 7-A is fast, 200 mph+. It's aerobatic and exiting. Sorry, not interested. It's my old fart syndrome, I guess.

As for the canopy, I have claustrophobia issue to be concerned about. My wife doesn't like pulling the lid down over her head and feeling intombed in the cockpit. Personally, I like the slider. I think its cool looking, especially when you're giving the "thumbs up" to people while your taxiing with the canopy rolled back. Compared to my Cessna, the visibility is greatly increased, even with the bar in the dash.

Thomas
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Post by Thomas »

Are the straight and level (and approach) flying characteristics that different between the 7 and the 9?

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hydroguy2
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Post by hydroguy2 »

Defining your mission is the first step...go ahead make a list of everything you want out of this project. Then after looking at that list for a while, list them in order of preference.

Here's an example list before prioritizing
loops, rolls, backcountry camping, 1000nm XC's, want to build, like to build, side by side, room for 2+dogs, 4seats for grandkids, $70-80K budget, IFR, VFR w/night, Wow factor, looks, all out speed.....

OK looking at this quicky list, you can see one plane can't have it all. Everything is a compromise, but what fits for YOU, is what is important.

7a or 9a, only you can really make that call. things like aerobatics, when you've never done them are a tough call. IFR or not?



Here is my reason for picking an 200hp RV-7, VFR w/night. my other choices were RV-10 and then -9A

My mission is: fun, XC's, backcountry grass and wife sitting beside me.

RV-10 with it's 4 seats was well outside my budget, RV-9a is listed as ~15mph slower. My wife likes minimum time in route, so 15mph is 15mph.

as far as the nosewheel vs tailwheel concerns. Backcountry grass swayed me to tailwheel. I had 1 hr of TW time when I decided. Another RV owner told me, "don't worry about it." "if you can't learn to land a tailwheel RV properly, you probably shouldn't be landing any RV."

AND I like my time in the shop. I love making things. Being in the shop is a big deal. if you want a RV to fly, buy one it's cheaper and quicker.

.........got your list done yet?

:wink:

EDIT: tip up or slider, I don't know which is tougher to build but my tip-up has been a real bugger to fit. I went tip-up due to cost, weight and I heard it was easier. some days I wish I had went slider....oh well too late now
Brian
Townsend, MT

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smittysrv
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Post by smittysrv »

Many moons ago, while I was waiting for my tailkit to arrive, I was bored and started collecting email streams from one of the yahoo groups. Here's one on the RV-7 vs RV-9:
http://smittysrv.com/emailpile.asp?ID=7

Here's another good read:
http://www.propjock.com/why.html

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Post by TomC »

Here are my thoughts:

1. If you ever think you might want to do aerobatics, build the 7A.

2. In the beginning, Vans made only 6A's and many were built and flown safely with normal pilot skills. The 7A is basically a 6A with a few small improvements. It is not difficult to fly in any part of flight. I, for sure, am no stud pilot but I feel confident in my ability to safely fly my 7A. I chose the 7A because of the slight chance I might want to do aerobatics in the future. In my opinion, the slightly higher landing speeds were of no consequence. I love the way my plane handles in the air. The roll rate is very quick if I make it but normally, I just use gentle aileron inputs.

3. Comparing a 9A to a 7A is like comparing a Mercedes to a Porsche. Both are excellent cars. Both are great cars to drive but if you ever want to really scoot or corner, pick the Porsche. If you want a smooth riding car, the Mercedes is best. Remember, however, that the Mercedes will never corner with the Porsche.

Just my $.02,

Thomas
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Post by Thomas »

Thanks all for all your input. One more question. Would a 7A be tame enough to learn how to fly in? I'm thinking about my kids who might want to earn their PPL in it.

Thanks again,

Tom

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hydroguy2
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Post by hydroguy2 »

When you throw training into the equation, it swings the meter towards the 9a.
Brian
Townsend, MT

Spike
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Post by Spike »

I would agree!!
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Midnight Sun
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Post by Midnight Sun »

Then again they could always learn in a trusty ole Cessna 150 and transition to a wicked fun airplane when finished.
Maesure with a micrometer, mark it with a crayon, cut it with an ax.

Bob Barrett
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Post by Bob Barrett »

The 9A was designed as a training airplane and I am sure the 9 would be a good training airplane also. You can get either the tip up or the slider. If you live in a warm climate the slider has it all over the tip up. I live in Minnesota and my 6A Slider is very nice to open on landing on warm days and to taxi with the slider open on hot days.

If you are a tail wheel pilot, stay with tail wheel. If you are not experienced with tail wheel airplanes, get experienced before making the decsion!

I had hopes that children or grand children would be able to train in my RV-6A but that is not real. I would still build a 6A, 6, or 7A or 7 if I were starting a new kit. You really need to know how important the training aspect is for you! I may never be able to do aerobatics but I sure like doing rolls with someone who can. I hope to try loops and a few other acros also.

Good Luck you will never regret having an RV!

flytoboat
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Post by flytoboat »

I originally decided to build a 9A for the lower landing speed. Then I saw some youtube videos of RV acro. Pretty much changed my mind to build a 7A when I got to do a roll in a 6A. Since my main mission for the airplane is cross country, the other benefit is a higher maneuvering speed, higher cruise speed if I want to burn the gas, and longer range with the bigger tanks. It all boils down to what you want to see when you open that hangar...
Don
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Thomas
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Post by Thomas »

Can someone tell me what approach speeds you normally fly in the 7?

Thanks again,

Tom

Thomas
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Post by Thomas »

Well - OK I should be able to answer this myself. According to Van, Vso in the 7A is 58 mph at gross. 1.3 X 58 = 75 MPH. Is this about what people are using for final approach speeds? That's pretty docile. I used 85 MPH in my Cherokee.

Correction - 1.3 x 51 MPH for the 7A = 66 mph

Spike
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Post by Spike »

Actually it sounds to me like your Cherokee final approach speed is pretty fast.

Spike
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Bob Barrett
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Post by Bob Barrett »

We are coming over the fence at 80 MPH with my RV-6A but with more experience I think we will be able to slow it down to 75 0r 70 MPH. We have Angle of Attack which we need to calibrate a little better and then I am sure we will get down to 70MPH

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