Greetings!, as well as a strange question.

mike_r · Post by **mike_r** » Wed May 23, 2007 2:24 pm

Hello every one!

My name is Mike, I'm living in London, Ontario, Canada. I have been a pilot for about 12 years now, and am ready to build a plane.

What I want now is something fast, and fun, like an RV-7. I really like the plane, good performance, good looks and happy owners.

Metal is my preference, as well as it being a low wing. Side by side seating keeps the wife happy, and good handling will keep us both happy.

So far the only downside (for my purpose) I can find about the RV series is there does not appear to be room for my dog in the back. I have a 70lb lab, he goes everywhere with us, and loves to fly (I would take the dog over the wife... but don't tell her that).

Is there a way to construct the fuselage that would allow for an open baggage compartment? Similier to the Cessna 150 style, but of course with more structural componets behind the seats, as I am certain that the deck over the baggage compartment is largly structural.

Any ideas or info on this would be greatly appreciated.

Thanks,
Mike_R

Post by **Spike** » Wed May 23, 2007 3:47 pm

Welcome to the group!!

The baggage area is rated for 100 lbs in the 7. Why not just let him climb on up in there. I would think he could do that. Youd just have to make sure that you had a way to secure him.

RV7Factory · Post by **RV7Factory** » Wed May 23, 2007 3:53 pm

Hi Mike,

Welcome!!!

As the owner (or does she own me) of a 65# lab, who also goes everywhere with me, I have thought much the same thing.

You have plenty of room in the baggage area behind the seats for a dog, as there isn't any cover except for the floor. The real problem is getting them back there. Having them climb up the wing is asking for trouble IMHO, and besides, lifting a 70# dog over the seats and into the baggage area would be a real treat.

The best solution would be to have a baggage door from the outside, but then again you are talking about modifying the skin, which in the case of an RV carries some of the load. Personally, that's a mod that I wouldn't feel comfortable making.

So bottom line is... I don't know. I am not much help am I?

dons · Post by **dons** » Wed May 23, 2007 4:24 pm

Welcome Mike.

I can't offer much advice about the seating arrangements for the 3rd member of your family, but I can say that picking the RV7 based on your analysis is right on for everything else. I went through the same thing about a year ago trying to decide, but didn't have the jump seat requirement. If you haven't tried both the baggage door and the over the seat access for your dog, you might want to before making any hard decisions about what plane you really want. It likely depends a lot on your dog and how much he wants to get into the plane, he may not care how it has to do it if staying behind is just not on option in his opinion. BTW, I'm in Waterloo.

mike_r · Post by **mike_r** » Wed May 23, 2007 4:53 pm

Hi all,

Thanks for the replies, quick too!

My puppy has no problem getting into and out of planes, boats, canoes, cars, golf carts, truck beds, atv's, and has flown in the back of a cherokee many times. I know he has no trouble getting up on the wings, properly, and knows to stay near the wing root, and what not to step on in the cockpit (headsets, not throttle quadrants...), so getting in would not be a problem.

I am under the impression though, that the baggage compartment in the RV 7 series does not offer pilot access when in flight. I thought that access is behind the seat backs, through a passage, like the TL-2000 Sting Carbon (the only other plane I know for sure in that configuration). Can you reach into the baggage compartment from the pilot seat in a RV 7? Like a Cessna 150?

If so, that is all I need, and I will be stating an RV 7 kit this fall!

Mike_R

JohnR · Post by **JohnR** » Wed May 23, 2007 6:17 pm

Welcome to Rivetbangers!

You can reach the baggage area by reaching over the seat backs. I would guess your dog, if he was back there, would fly with his head on your shoulder until he got tired of standing then there is plenty of room for him to lie down.

I'm sure Chad and CJ will jump in here. They both plan on taking their dog's along on occasion I believe.

mike_r · Post by **mike_r** » Wed May 23, 2007 6:40 pm

Hi!

Really??!!??!!?! That is great news!

Yes, my dog likely will stand for the first few flights, but I can restrain him from moving around too much with cushions. He will also be seat belted with his harness, just like in the car.

This is excellent, so the next question is to "A" or not to "A"...

Once that is satified, it's a matter of horsepower. I am sold on the Lycoming powerplants, no question there.

Mike_R

TomC · Post by **TomC** » Wed May 23, 2007 7:57 pm

Hi Mike,

I have a few (13) golden retrievers. I have thought alot about this issue. My solution is leaning towards making the passenger seat lay forward for the dog to get into the back, crawling under the seatback bulkhead. After the dog is loaded, the passenger seat can be re-positioned for its human occupant. Like someone mentioned, the problem will be getting the dog onto the wing without scratching the paint or worse. I was thinking of using a rubber backed bath mat and laying it on the wingwalk. Other than that, the dog should be fine in the baggage compartment as there is plenty of room IF I don't take anything else. Before I take a dog, I will get a pair of dog "headsets" to protect their hearing.

Good Luck!

mike_r · Post by **mike_r** » Wed May 23, 2007 8:49 pm

Hi Tom!

13 dogs? Your dog food bill must be huge, not to mention the vet bills! I could not imagine, my one dog keeps me busy enough!

The wing for me is not a problem, as my dog has been trained to stay on the wing walk (black) and step lightly. Yeah, he is a really good dog... although I think I will still get a thick matt for "just in case". After all, he is still a dog, and cannot possible understand how important it is he stays on the black.

So there is a cross brace behind the seat backs, that is likely what I was seeing in the pictures. Then a folding seat back would certainly make that easier. He is really good at slinking down and crawling, so I might look into that option as well. Although as long as I could make the landing soft enough (safe enough) jumping the seat back should not be a problem.

Doggie defenders?, they make them specific? That would be great!

Also, anyone have any pictures of their baggage area available? I have been looking online and have yet to come across any good pictures. I suppose I will have to seek out an RV in my area soon, and get to know the owner!

Mike_R

svanarts · Post by **svanarts** » Thu May 24, 2007 12:37 am

Hi Tom and welcome. You're dog is going to love his new airplane. If the dog has trouble getting in the back you could always teach your wife to gently climb over the railing and into the baggage area. That way your well behaved dog could sit up front with you and enjoy his new airplane. Just kidding.

I'm not being very helpful either I'm afraid. But yes, I think you'll be pleased with the baggage area arrangement and so will your dog. Looking forward to tracking your progress!

TomC · Post by **TomC** » Thu May 24, 2007 9:22 am

Mike,

For a dog to jump out of the baggage area over the seat backs, you had better build a tip-up. On my slider, there is not enough room between the top of the seat backs and the canopy frame. That is why I was thinking about laying the passenger seat forward and down. This is kind of how they are designed anyway. I might have to just pull the seatback hinge pins at the bottom, remove it for dog entry/exit, and then replace the hinge pins. This should only take a couple of seconds.

As for dog hearing protection, check out this website:

http://www.safeandsoundpets.com/index.html

Fly Safe!

cjensen · Post by **cjensen** » Thu May 24, 2007 9:28 am

Hey Mike!! As the others have already said, WELCOME to Rivetbangers!!

I have two Golden's, and I plan on taking them with me at some point down the road in my 7. Wiley is the older one, and he weighs in at 65#'s, and Yeager (TomC has a Yeager too!) just turned 1, and weighs in at 48#'s, so I probably won't be taking them both with me at the same time. Both of them are trim dogs, and they will fit in the back while restrained. I don't see much of a problem with what you want to do at all. I think the major points have been covered already.

Get crackin' on that 7!!

cjensen · Post by **cjensen** » Thu May 24, 2007 9:30 am

TomC wrote:Mike,

For a dog to jump out of the baggage area over the seat backs, you had better build a tip-up.

You'll have the same problem with a tip up though. The roll bar is actually a bit thicker than the slider bar, and will cause the same (perhaps more?) hinderance...

TomC · Post by **TomC** » Thu May 24, 2007 9:54 am

Mike,

You said

13 dogs?

To be correct, I said I had 13 goldens. In addition to this, there is an Australian Shepherd, 2 miniature wirehair dachsunds, 2 cats and some fish. Its quite a zoo. My wife shows the dogs and several of them are champions. The dogs are her hobby and the 7A is mine. Its up in the air who's is more expensive.

cjensen · Post by **cjensen** » Thu May 24, 2007 9:58 am

TomC wrote:Its up in the air who's is more expensive.

I'll second that WHOLEHEARTEDLY!!!

mike_r · Post by **mike_r** » Thu May 24, 2007 12:09 pm

Hi all,

Ok, so I will need to take some measurements on different canopy configurations. I bet I could do that at OSH! I will have to remember to bring a tape measure...

I do like the tip up much better than the slider, I suppose it is due to flying the Sting Carbon, Im just used to it.

Currently I have been wrapping a scarf around his head, keeping his ears flat agains his head and he seems comfortable. I will be investing in a pair of those mutt muffs, that is great! I like the co-pilot scarf as well.

The next hurdle is finding a house to rent with a garage. Should not be too hard, for my work I travel the city every day installing cable (yes, I'm a cable guy) so I should be able to find something suitable fairly quick. I would like to get my practise kits at OSH, and start right away.

TomC, I lived at a zoo once, but a smaller zoo than yours. I had 6 cats, 2 birds, a goldfish and red squirrels living in the basement (uninvited). Now we are down to one dog, and what a relief!

Mike_R

captain_john · Post by **captain_john** » Thu May 24, 2007 3:29 pm

JohnR wrote:Welcome to Rivetbangers!

You can reach the baggage area by reaching over the seat backs. I would guess your dog, if he was back there, would fly with his head on your shoulder until he got tired of standing then there is plenty of room for him to lie down.

I'm sure Chad and CJ will jump in here. They both plan on taking their dog's along on occasion I believe.

I plan on taking my 60# Aussie dog with me. He will indeed fit into the baggage compartment and I plan on making some type of false floor to stow gear while we are on a trip.

He is agile so, getting him into the back shouldn't be a problem. I will carry a blanket for the wing so he doesn't scratch the paint. I hope he learns to get into position all by himself so I don't blow my back out getting him in the plane!

When the wife isn't with me he will likely sit next to me. I plan on removing the control stick and using the piano hinges to hold a "doggie bed" in place and tethering him to the base. Same thing goes for when he is in the baggage area.

Of course, this is all imaginary right now. I plan to do my level best to make it all work out. I think I can. At least, it is worth giving it a shot!

My golden was just too big, I think. He was more like 75-80#. That is one reason why I chose the Aussie dog this time around.

CJ

1:1_Scale · Post by **1:1_Scale** » Thu May 24, 2007 3:33 pm

Wasn't there someone selling a kit that would give you the option of having the slider canopy, but it would also tilt forward for easy access to the baggage area? I'm 100% sure I've seen that somewhere, but I don't have the link handy

Could be perfect for dogs

captain_john · Post by **captain_john** » Thu May 24, 2007 7:32 pm

Meske was/is?

I didn't see it as a good solution to the canine problem.

You still would have to lift the little bugger up and over the longeron. Still, it looked like a nice product.

CJ